For the first time in quite some time, the hockey world saw a blockbuster in early August, watching the San Jose Sharks trade defenseman Erik Karlsson to the Pittsburgh Penguins in a three-team deal. In recent trades over the last several years, teams have typically weaponized cap space as a third-team, retaining salary and usually getting mid to late-round picks in return. A unique aspect of this trade, however, is that the third team, the Montreal Canadiens, were able to take care of some business they had been hoping to accomplish for a while, namely removing forward Mike Hoffman’s salary off their books.
Running up to the Karlsson trade, speculation had arisen about how much the Sharks would eventually retain on Karlsson’s contract, and for the most part, it was much lower than many experts had theorized. San Jose only retained $1.5MM (13%) of Karlsson’s $11.5MM salary, effectively clearing $10MM from their cap table over the next four years. Nevertheless, the Sharks did take back salary in exchange with Hoffman ($4.5MM), Mikael Granlund ($5MM), and Jan Rutta ($2.75MM), but all three of these deals will be off their books after the 2024-25 NHL season.
Lastly, at face value, the Penguins appear to be the undeniable winner in this deal. Even though he has not played a game for Pittsburgh, acquiring the best player in the deal always looks good. Surprisingly though, and maybe even more importantly long-term than acquiring Karlsson, the Penguins were able to move some poor contracts out from the Ron Hextall era, including Granlund, Rutta, Casey DeSmith ($1.8MM), and Jeff Petry ($4.69MM – 25% retained). New General Manager Kyle Dubas was able to add a $10MM player in Karlsson, while also creating $3MM of cap space in the same deal, a feat that has been largely difficult for most teams in the salary cap era.
Now that the complete trade is public and final, and knowing the perspectives of all three teams, who do you think ultimately won the Karlsson trade?
I actually quite like San Jose’s roster on Forward as it stands. A good mix of talent and role players. Defensively… Yikes. Goaltending won’t be there to bail them out either. Gonna be a lot of 6-4 games this year I think. Considering a theoretical depth chart…
Forward:
Barabanov – Hertl – Duclair
Eklund – Couture – Hoffman
Labanc – Grandlund – Lindblom
Kunin/Zadina – Sturm – Zetterlund/Smith
Defence:
Ferraro – Benning
Burroughs – Rutta
Vlasic – Šimek
MacDonald
Goal:
Blackwood
Kähkönen
I don’t think the Sharks will be as bad this year as last. I think to push for the playoff bubble, they will need Blackwood to regain his best form – and maybe that happens under Nabokov’s coaching – and a legitimate top pairing defender. But as it stands, this team will at least be competitive, and perhaps they will find the D upgrade through a camp surprise. It’s happened before! Will be a fun, scrappy team to watch this year.
In Pittsburgh though, I see a handful of high-scoring players and a pretty weak team after them, playing in front of an inconsistent and oft-injured goalie.
I honestly don’t think Pittsburgh makes the playoffs this year, while San Jose will probably finish like 10th in their conference.
Interesting. I have the Sharks at #32 at the moment lol. Let’s see how they start this season. I am always interested in teams in transition, so I’ll follow them more closely this season.
No way they finish 32. Hertl and Couture are both legitimate top six centres, and the players likely to play on their wings are, with the exception of Eklund, proven scorers. The bottom 6 looks competent too, not full of AHLers like past years. Granlund is not worth $5M, but he’s still a great option at 3C. Defence is a weakness, but it was last year too. Burroughs is an improvement over Karlsson defensively. My prediction hinges largely on Blackwood being not total garbage, which is a roll of the dice admittedly. But looking at the league, I think Phoenix, Montreal and Anaheim are all in way worse shape than San Jose.
Add in the Flyers too who won’t be trying to compete
It seems each team accomplished what it set out to do: SJ moved an expensive asset for assets whose contracts expire sooner thus hastening their ability to rebuild, Pitt rid themselves of bad contracts & gained one expensive contract to bolster their “win now” approach, and MTL moved out forwards they didn’t want & got both a pick and assets they might be able to move later. People may disagree with each team’s current plan, but it seems like everyone made out according to their own plan.
I like San Jose and Montreal’s outcome here. I don’t like Pittsburgh’s.
San Jose wanted way more in return and they took on a lot. Sure they expire sooner than karlsson, but they are doomed to suck for 2 more years at least. A protected first rounder is a fail for them and they had to give up their own third rounder. This cannot be viewed as a win for them. Cap space is nice, but they aren’t going to use it any time soon. Pittsburgh meanwhile needed more offense from their defense and they cleared cap in this deal. They don’t even need karlsson to be Norris caliber for this to work. It’s a gamble in the contract, but most penguins fans view this as playing with house money. We will suck in a couple years regardless, who cares about his contract then. Personally, you could take karlsson out of this trade and I still see it as a win for Pittsburgh. They cleared some garbage.
Woah take off the glasses buddy. We have the worst d corp, worst goalie tandem and a bottom 5 forward group. Should be either 30th or worse.
Montreal and Anaheim definitely have better rosters in every area – especially at forward. We have 9 bottom 6 forwards and 1 bona-fide 1st liner in hertl – yikes. Arizona have some gaps but generally are a better team as shown last year when they took a step forward.
If you don’t like Pittsburgh’s outcome then you simply:
A. Did not understand their current state and/or lack of alternative outcomes to bettering their 2023 roster
B. Do not agree with them trying to maximize their (admittedly small odds) at winning the Cup in 2023
If its B I don’t know what to tell you. You’re just stating the obvious and shouting in the wind. Everyone can see what they are doing and understands they are digger a deeper hole post-Sid. Not exactly rocket science.
Glad they don’t need Karlsson to be norris caliber because he never has been….ever, never will be.
That’s just completely ignorant.
I think he means more in terms of being a defenseman which to be fair is true. Karlsson has always been a very good scorer but he’s never been a good Defender.
Since when has the Norris actually been about “defense”. Karlsson had the pick so much that he’s hardly in his own zone. BTW, the sharks were actually break even when he was on the ice as opposed to without him where they were completely under water. He obviously helped the defense, just in a different way.
He may help the defense by driving the play offensively, but if you wanna argue he is a good at playing defense I won’t waste my time even entertaining the convo, cause that’s ignorance. Karlsson is great offensive defenseman who sucks in his own end. Let’s call a spade a spade. Come the playoffs is when Karlssons weakness in his own end will be very apparent. I hope the pens take a run at another cup, I would love to see it. But Karlsson defensively sucks, sorry if that upsets you, it is what it is.
Never said he was great at defending. I said he controls the puck so much that it’s basically the same thing. Plus pettersson is good in his own end, that’s why I’m not worried about it.
I figure they play him a lot with Pettersson or maybe Graves? The pp for Pitt will be fun to watch. I like that they are going for it, will be some bad years at the end of this run, but if they win a cup or even have a great run it’s worth it imo
The answer? EK65 and the #FreeEK65 crew, of course. ;)
Can’t say who won, but Pittsburgh lost. Giving up a 1st and 2nd, when your prospect cupboard is as bare as Old Mother Hubbard’s, is simply insane, especially when the offenseman you pick up isn’t what you need, to fix the 19th ranked defense in GA. If last season was an anomaly for him, and looking at the past 5 years, it likely is, then they whiffed badly. Scorched earth is not a smart approach. It’ll take them years to undo this tomfoolery.
It’s a protected first, so they gave up a late first in a draft that won’t even be as good as last year’s. They also got a third rounder back while sending out a second. It’s basically a crapsshoot past the fifteenth pick most years, so those are a wash essentially. Pittsburgh gave up next to nothing of value.
@Tang
Doesn’t matter. You need to stock that farm system. Farm systems aren’t only to develop NHL players, they’re also to create competition up and down your organization, and foster a winning attitude. Pittsburgh has the consensus worst farm system, and the 2nd worst AHL team. Without legit prospects, your organization will be losing at every level. The prospects you do have won’t know a culture of winning, and may not be properly developed. Seriously, when you do get legit prospects again, do you want them to start out in a losing atmosphere, in the AHL?
Saying you gave up nothing is very short-sighted.
While I understand your comment of “restocking the farm” it’s clear that the Pens message is that they’re going to compete for a cup during the Crosby/Mallon years. Will they win it all? Probably not, but as a fan I would much rather see the team try and do everything in their power to win a last cup while keeping franchise icons around. I don’t want to see Crosby/Malkin/Letang in a different jersey. I’d much rather watch the team go all in for the last few years of that trios career and watch them raise their jersey in the rafters than watch them in another jersey.
Prospects are just that, prospects. Fans know that there will be dark years coming, the fans know that Karlsons contract will be an albatross if it isn’t already.
I’d rather watch them try and win now, rebuild when the band retires and be hopeful these next few seasons. Pittsburghers know what meritocracy is, all you have to do is go to PNC park.
@tyler
The term I will use from now on is “scorched earth”. The Penguins aren’t just going all in, they’re leaving behind almost nothing. In battle, scorched earth is destroying everything you come on, or leaving nothing behind you. It’s not a preferred situation, and neither is it in hockey.
The only situations that I can remember of NHL teams leaving scorched earth of this magnitude, are the Penguins post-Jagr, and the Nordiques, post-Hunter. Those Pens got Crosby, those Nordiques got Lindros, and flipped him for Forsberg etc. These Pens can’t count on a Crosby or a Lindros. They might endure years of losing, for the next Nail Yakupov, or Alexis Lafreniere, or even Alexandre Daigle.
Like I said above, the entire system needs restocked. Without draft picks, the team will have to resort to college, European and CHL free agents. There can be a lot of talent there, but what guarantee is there that those free agents want to sign in the most dismal farm system out there, where you’re guaranteed at best a mediocre team, or perhaps, years of losing, at every level?
Hey, look at it through black and gold sunglasses, for all I care, but the way I see it, it’s pretty bleak for you. And will be for a long time. This could be Buffalo bad.
@KRB
Do you even understand Pittsburgh hockey? The penguins are not worried anijt mid to late 1st round picks right now. They are in win now or bust mode.
In 3 years this team will be in a total tear down and rebuild.
They are not and should no be worried about prospects who won’t help them anytime soon.
This has to be one of the worse takes I’ve read in a while.
You obviously have no clue how this team is being run right now. No clue.
@KRB
Just give it up already.
Everyone in Pittsburgh knows what’s coming. It’s inevitable.
You really are clueless.
@KRB
You do know AHL success doesn’t guarantee success in the NHL.
You also know that some teams stock their AHL team with guys who are not prospects right?
Take your AHL rankings and prospect rankings and move on.
It’s the most ridiculous argument for this team.
@Tjeck
I understand NHL and AHL hockey. I’ve been following NHL hockey for 50 years, and AHL for 30 years.
I understand they’re in win now mode. I get that part. Here’s what you don’t get: in the shape that they’re in, it’s a stupid thing to do.
You think it’s a bad take, because I told the truth, and it’s not what you wanted to hear.
You traded for a guy with one great season in the last five, with 4 mediocre, injury riddled seasons, who won’t fix your 19th ranked defense, and won’t get you any closer to a Cup. And gave up two desperately needed draft picks for the privilege.
“mid to late 1st round picks right now.”
The pick is Top Ten protected. If it’s used in 2024, it could be as high as 11.
Sorry the truth hurts.
@Tjeck
Oh gee, I’ve been watching AHL hockey for 30 years, but I needed you to come along, and tell me that teams sign AHL vets to win.
Thanks Captain Obvious, that was really helpful.
You didn’t get the point that winning AHL teams help foster winning environments in the organization. They don’t necessarily translate into Stanley Cups, but a winning culture, at all levels, is something to be strive for.
The point of AHL teams, or ECHL teams for that matter, is not always to churn out NHLers. It’s also to foster competition throughout each level of the organization, and to have talent ready to step up into each level of the organization. Pittsburgh doesn’t have that, and probably won’t, for years.
“Take your AHL rankings and prospect rankings and move on.”
No. I’ll watch the Wilkes-Barre Penguins closely this year, and give you weekly updates, if you like. And let you know if they are mediocre, bad, or Florence Foster Jenkins bad.
Have you even watched hockey, before this year, or are you new?
Do you understand hockey?
A team in Win NOW mode isn’t worried about 2026/2027.
They have to make the most out of the Crosby/Malkin window.
Why are you so dense that you want to keep beating on this ridiculous premise that the Pens are worried about prospects in the AHL?
They are not trying to build a future, the future is now.
EVERYONE knows this, and EVERYONE but you seems to understand that it will be a long and ugly rebuild.
But yeah man keep worrying about winning in the AHL.
Please give me weekly updates. Please show how pathetic and lonely you truly are.
This truth doesn’t hurt. Everyone with a brain knows there is no pipeline.
You calling me captain obvious is ironic.
You are trying to make an issue of something that is already known.
What don’t you understand?
Everyone knows what the future holds.
This is just a stupid waste of your time or you are just desperate to sound smart
@Tjeck
“Do you understand hockey?”
Why yes. I watched Orr, Howe, Gretzky, both Esposito, many others. I watched California Golden Seals games. Ive attended two Stanley Cup parades, three Calder Cup celebrations, and met hundreds of players, like Dale Hunter, Peter Bondra, Rod Langway, Miro Heiskanen, Jamie Benn etc.
“Why are you so dense that you want to keep beating on this ridiculous premise that the Pens are worried about prospects in the AHL?”
What you call dense, I call facing reality. If it’s a choice between building for the future, and treading water, it’s best to start building for the future. Karlsson isn’t gonna win you a cup. At best, he’ll get you a couple of 1st round playoff exits. With good luck, and dynamite goaltending (which Jarry has never done in the playoffs) maybe a single series win. May as well shave a few years off now, and look ahead.
I’m sorry the cognitive dissonance I’m laying on you hurts so badly. Better you hear it now, then finally come to the realization in 6 months, or a year, or whatever. It’s sure hurting a lot of Pen fans here.
Methinx you’re a sock puppet I know. I know the hand in that sock. Funny. You change personalities like some people change underwear.
You would make the absolute worse GM possible.
Again dense, just talking to talk. Trying to win an argument that isn’t even an argument.
You are trying to lay out facts that are already known and trying to sound smart doing it.
Everyone in Pittsburgh has been facing reality for the last 4+ years.
Everyone know the Crosby/Malkin years are closing. Perhaps it’s loyalty that the team wants to honor the guys that brought them 3 cups by continuing to try and win.
Once they are done the years will be dark.
I don’t know why you are acting like you just cracked a code and are revealing earth shattering news.
Nothing and I repeat NOTHING you’ve said is painful nor new. But thanks for all your time and useless attempts.
@Tjeck
Your petty insults reveal who you are. You don’t have the guts to face me, so have to invent new personalities.
As always, you have to resort to nastiness, because your severe Borderline Personality Disorder keeps you from having a rational, intelligent argument. You’re the one with the lonely life. Everytime you insult me, it’s just a projection. I can read you like a book. Seriously, get some meds.
“I don’t know why you are acting like you just cracked a code and are revealing earth shattering news.”
Nothing you write ever makes sense. You were the one trying to convince me. I stated my opinion. But as always, whether it’s politics or hockey, it drives you to meltdown status, when someone disagrees with you.
One thing this has shown me. I live rent free in your head.
It boils down to one actual pick. Like I said the other 2 are a wash. That is worth giving up for a potentially elite player to help Sid win one more. Not to mention that dubas and Sullivan fully recognize your point and that is why they gave one way deals to semi NHL caliber players that will help the ahl team win and support their few prospects. There will be pain for years after Sid. No one should care.
@Tang
Good analysis. Thanks for being polite.
As always? You act like you know me. Lol
I’ll face ya any time ya want lil fella.
I’m not upset with your point of view and I’ve stated time and time again that you are essentially trying to reinvent the wheel with your posts.
You are stating the obvious, there is nothing earth shattering in your arguments.
I’d love to know how many real NHL GMs with Crosby and Malkin would be worried about picks right now.
Also we don’t know the mandate of new ownership.
But go ahead and regurgitate the same useless info that everyone is already well aware of.
This isn’t even an argument. It’s me calling you out for trying to act like you are revealing something that isn’t already well known in Pittsburgh.
I can’t say I know where we discuss politics or how often I even post on this site anymore.
But thanks for the diagnosis.
And trust me you will be a distant memory in no time.
@Tjeck
I do know you. You’re a sock puppet. And you’re a pretty bad actor.
“This isn’t even an argument. It’s me calling you out for trying to act like you are revealing something that isn’t already well known in Pittsburgh.”
Calling me out for giving my opinion? And you’re saying my opinion is right, because it’s well known in Pittsburgh, but you’re calling me out for it? For a correct opinion. OOOOOOOOOK
“You are stating the obvious, there is nothing earth shattering in your arguments.”
I never said there was. You’re the one melting down here. I told the truth. You freaked out. And your circular arguments are a trademark of your other personalities.
“EVERYONE knows this, and EVERYONE but you seems to understand that it will be a long and ugly rebuild.”
No, as usual, you are being obtuse, and putting words in my mouth. It will be a long and ugly rebuild, no matter what. My point is that if Pen GMs keep spending like shopaholics with platinum credit cards, it will be longer, and uglier.
A sock puppet and bad actor?
That’s your labels?
Still love to know how many times we’ve interacted before this thread, I’ve never changed my name on here, maybe you have. Also kind of creepy that you seem to “know” me. And where again have we discussed politics?
Call me what ya like but a rebuild is a rebuild and it’s not going to start till Crosby and Malkin are gone and there is no reason not to use all your resources to put a full blown attempt at one last run. It’s not going to take any longer. The picks you are talking about would have been dealt at the deadline anyway.
If you want to be upset about traded picks be upset at the one dealt for Granlund.
Draft picks will be a luxury for this team until the big 3 walk away.
@Tjeck
Ah, being obtuse. You don’t know what a sock puppet is. Terrible acting job.
I’m not upset about Pittsburgh trading any picks. I’m a Capitals fan, and I’m enjoying the Pittsburgh flameout.
But I’m a hockey fan first, and I called it as I saw it.
“The picks you are talking about would have been dealt at the deadline anyway.”
So instead of banking the picks to improve at the deadline, you trade them now, for a guy you don’t need, and won’t help you. Smart /sarc
You continue to claim to know me but again provide no facts to back up the claim.
As a Pens fan I truly feel sorry for Ovi a generational talent wasted for one single cup.
Looking at the state of the caps I can see how banking the picks has helped Ovi in his final years.
Keep those picks and enjoy your solo cup!
Keep enlightening the world with your earth shattering observations that no one was ever aware of!
We’d all be lost without your 30 years of hockey knowledge.
@Tjeck
50 years actually
“You continue to claim to know me but again provide no facts to back up the claim.”
Why is this important to you?
“Keep those picks and enjoy your solo cup!”
The one Cup was great! That much sweeter, because we had to wait for it. And it’s one year more recent than any Pittsburgh has won.
“Keep enlightening the world with your earth shattering observations that no one was ever aware of!”
Thank you, I will. I enjoy enlightening people.
“Looking at the state of the caps I can see how banking the picks has helped Ovi in his final years.”
They should have started their rebuild 2 years ago. The problem with Pitt and Washington management is thinking old, slow, poorly put together teams, with subpar goaltending were cup contenders.
It’s important cause it’s creepy to claim you know someone.
One year closer… woo hoo. It’s still just 1.
“They should have started their rebuild 2 years ago. The problem with Pitt and Washington management is thinking old, slow, poorly put together teams, with subpar goaltending were cup contenders.”
The irony in this comment is that I actually 100% agree with you.
But in the same token I think it’s old school loyalty mentality. As if the orgs feel they owe it to the stars to keep fighting for cups as long as they were around.
@Tjeck
It’s one year. I don’t care if it’s one or five. And when the rebuilds start in earnest, after Crosby and Ovi retire, by virtue of a well stocked farm system, the Capitals will be closer to going back. Much closer.
You must be new to the online world, because sock puppets are as old as the internet itself. Do you really not know what one is?
“The irony in this comment is that I actually 100% agree with you.”
If you had started with a civil tone, from the beginning, we could have had a good back and forth on this. I’m willing to engage anyone, as long as it’s polite. But you started with insults right away. That dragged it down.
I’m really not sure what you are suggesting the Penguins should have done THIS offseason. You seem to be pinning the sins of GMs past on Dubas. He inherited a mess and was told by ownership to put together a Cup Contender.
Criticizing anything done prior to that is cherry picking the obvious mistakes that drove Pens fans insane and being emboldened with the power of hindsight.
So, you are Dubas. You take the job. You agree to put a better team on the ice and go for a Cup in ‘23. Without the cop out of “I wouldn’t take that job in a million years” or “I wouldn’t agree to that”…
What would you have done this offseason? You needed a starting goalie, inherited a shaky D, a bottom 6 with more holes than swiss cheese, a largely barren farm system (minus a few fringe NHL Dmen), and only enough Cap Space to fill half those problems due to a number of bad contracts due to average (or worse) players.
This was a problem without a good solution. You can shout into the wind that they should be rebuilding already until you are blue in the face, but that isn’t the directive from Ownership, so repeating it 8000x on these boards seems like a massive waste of time.
I don’t deal with ignorance and that’s what you were being toward Tang imo.
You took a know it all stance and beat your same drum over and over and over.
You claim to know me and claim that I post stupid comments often and blow up over politics.
Call me a sock puppet but you talk like you do on here to me in person and you’ll get the same response. I’m at the IDGAF age.
Well said. But some people want to continue to shout into the wind about picks and minor league winning.
@ Mr Goodkat: What do I do if ownership demands I go for a Cup *this* year?
Leaving aside that I doubt the ownership’s done any such thing (you would think, for instance, that if that was the SOP, they’d take that stance with marquee teams such as the Boston Red Sox or Liverpool FC, far more valuable franchises than the Penguins)? Then I DON’T TAKE THE JOB. Short of them getting back 27-year-old versions of Lemieux, Jagr and Fleury, Cups are just not going to happen no matter what. Only an idiot promises the impossible.
Ok so you went with the cop out answer. Thanks for playing.
And don’t take my word for it — it’s public information mate:
“According to Beeston, rebuilding is not an option; they believe the Penguins have what it takes to win and compete for championships.
‘Our goal is to compete for the Stanley Cup every year,” Beeston said. “We believe deeply in this core, and we are disappointed that our season isn’t continuing.’
“Fenway Sports Group believes the core are not only capable players, but the extensions to Malkin and Letang last off-season confirmed their values to towards the team.
‘The commitment that was made last summer, re-signing key players that were free agents that were part of this core,” Beeston said. “Sort of spoke to the commitment and where our focus is.’”
Ownership is not interested in rebuilding yet. Dubas was brought in and given the seemingly impossible challenge of turning Hextall’s mess into a Cup Contender.
Are they? Boy they’d need everything break just right and even then. So, objectively, no.
But can you honestly say they are worse today than they were last week?
This trade was a win given the task Dubas was given.
You asked a question. I gave the answer. Whether you LIKE the answer or not I don’t really give a $hit about; we are none of us expected to play along with your straw man games.
Can I honestly say the team is worse than it was last week? Not really — Pittsburgh did get rid of some underperforming people. But we’re talking about a team that missed the playoffs despite a startlingly good and healthy season from Malkin and strong years from several of the supporting cast. Crosby, Malkin, Letang, the oldest team in the league is no younger: only one of their top ten forwards will be under 30 in October.
See, the question you should be asking is this: is the team worse than it was at this time last year? Any Penguins fan is making a big bet: that Geno and Karlsson doesn’t miss a bunch of games again, that deep into their thirties Crosby and Letang don’t start the aging process every damn player eventually does, that Carter doesn’t fall further, that Smith and Graves are at least equal replacements for Zucker and Dumoulin, that Nedeljkovic somehow improves sharply instead of being the utter waste of space he’s been the last two seasons.
And that’s with a number of those things going right last year … and the team FAILING anyway. Which some of us predicted in advance, and which the board’s yinzers screamed was Certainly Not The Case, and they Couldn’t Waste Sid’s Last Years. The epitome of stupidity is to take the same strategy that failed last time and do more of it.
I acknowledge, understand, and even agree with a good deal of all the tired, obvious, rehashed “analysis” you are presenting.
What neither of you seems to be grasping is that it doesn’t matter. Rebuilding was not an option on the table for Dubas. It’s literally not what he was hired to do. I can dig up more direct quotes from ownership if you’d like.
Based on what he was hired to do (and the situation he inherited) this was a good trade.
Hilarious that you call straw man on me yet immediately ignore that that^ is my entire point and start spouting off the same, stale, irrelevant assessment about their odds of contending this year and bleak future.
Which I’m sure we’ll get another dose of in 3…2…1…
they don’t need a farm
Sid is done in 3 years.
win now > everything
KRB
pens kept their past 2 #1s
have Pickering and Yager
have found great icetime from the likes of Jon Marino, Bryan Rust and Brian Doumolin… none of which were top picks
their last 1st round picks that they kept turned out to be
Beau Bennet
Joe Morrow
Derek Pouliot
…absolutely would cash those guys in for proven vets if they could do it again
As a Ranger fan I think all teams semi won, however we won’t truly know if PIT won until after the 2024 season. If PIT makes the cup in the 2023 or 2024 season it’s a win but if EK doesn’t mesh or reverts back his previous 4 seasons with SJ where he got injured every year, this is a disaster for PIT who will then be saddled after 2024, paying a 36yr old 10mil for 2 more seasons
Hardly a disaster. We cleared basically 10 million tied up in already under performing players. At worst, we are probably a wash with where we would have been, at best we are a dangerous team. The last 2 years of karlssons contract don’t matter. If we suck by then, they will be clearing house and won’t even be a cap team. That money doesn’t matter to ownership either.
@Tang it
You do know your farm system is a consensus worst in the league, right? You do know your AHL affiliate was 2nd worst in the AHL, last season, right? You do know Karlsson doesn’t bring what your team actually needs, which is a stronger defense, and goaltending, right?
If it’s salary in, and salary out, it’d be a win for Pittsburgh. But the draft picks are a killer. Forget for the moment about how bad your system is gonna be post-Crosby. But you don’t have those picks, or anything else but later picks, to trade for something that plugs a hole, at this year’s, or next year’s deadlines.
It’s fascinating to watch Penguins fans rationalize this.
You cleared up cap space for 2023 but are screwed for the 2025 and 2026 season when Crosby contract is up but you are still paying EK and LeTang crazy money at age 39. Like i said, you’ll trade a bad 2025 and 2026 season if it means winning a cup this season or next. But again, key word is IF
Quite. This pretty much guarantees the rebuild can’t really start until 2028, and Yinzer Nation seems utterly committed to the bizarre premise that Karlsson is guaranteed to (a) continue to play full seasons, and (b) continue to deliver 100-pt seasons.
Never mind the “Oh we got rid of bad contracts!!” Even presuming that the Petry and DeSmith contracts were bad (they were not), not a single one of those deals over which they were p1ssing and moaning lingers past 2025. Granlund certainly had to go, but nothing stopped them from a buyout.
They also retained $1.5M on Petry don’t forget.
Your take was wrong above and it’s wrong here too. I don’t care about picks or prospects right now. Thanks for expressing concern for the penguins though.
Also, you obviously don’t understand their biggest needs. Goal tending was not a problem, it was a health problem. Jarry was an all star twice before, he will be fine if healthy. Graves is a massive upgrade over dumoulin and now they have balance on every pair. A good defender and a good offensive defenseman for each. Their biggest glaring issue was the bottom six and special teams. Karlsson is a huge upgrade to the power play and they’ve added some great defensive forwards. They may not have depth scoring, but they shouldn’t give up as many, plus their defense should make up for the lack of offense from the bottom six. Dubas did the best he could with the hand hextall dealt him.
@Tang
“Jarry was an all star twice before, he will be fine if healthy.”
I watched him very closely in the playoffs. Obviously, so did every team that faced him. He was VERY shaky. They knew his holes, and exploited him. An all star nod, and $5 buys you a cup of coffee, come playoff time.
Karlsson doesn’t help a 19th ranked defense. In fact, he makes it worse. You probably won’t be getting 2022-23 EK offensively, and defensively, you don’t want any year EK. That’s, if he even stays healthy.
I love Lars Eller (for obvious reasons, being a Cap fan), but he doesn’t have much left in the tank. Caps fans were shocked we even got anything for him, at the deadline. Some were proposing buying him out last summer.
I don’t believe they’ve improved as much as you think they have.
The key phrase is “for the chance to win”. Pittsburgh doesn’t need to win another cup to cement a legacy for anyone. It either be nice and a good send off for everyone, but this trade was about giving them a chance. It will not be a fail if they don’t win. Everyone just wants to see competitive teams around Sid for a couple more years. After that will be the dark ages regardless.
You miss the point completely. No one in Pittsburgh cares about the seasons past 2025. We are giving Sid a chance. Even if karlsson flops, it’s fine, they have 3 cups. There is a higher probability of this working than keeping the known quantity which fell short last year. The contracts weren’t all bad, but something needed to change and they took up space. All of you must be closet, future penguins fans because you seem to care so much about their future. Way more than we do.
He played in one playoff a few years ago. Sure it wasn’t great, but he also was newly a starter and he had no one behind him to count on. He played one injured game against the rangers. That’s hardly enough to draw conclusions. That is also the reason most penguin fans wanted to go a different direction. Because he hadn’t proven it for sure and his health. Everyone knows he can be elite, we just didn’t want to gamble on sids career. Now that he’s signed though, we all know what he’s capable of, he just has to stay healthy.
Two other quick points. You are glossing over the graves signing and elimination of dumo. Also, I wasn’t a fan of the Eller move, but they have a ton of depth guys to compete now, so we’ll see.
San Jose and Pittsburgh simply traded problems, Montreal fared the best in this socalled blockbuster, For me it was a lackluster!!!!
The assets we gave up were the going rate to remove Hextall’s bad contracts (a bit less actually when you consider how many bad deals we moved) AND THEN we got the first 100 point D man in 30 years for free.
If you want to argue we shouldn’t have had to clean up Hextall’s mess? I agree, but…we did, because he was a potted plant.
We traded all our bad players (sans NMC protected Jeff Carter) for the reigning Norris winner. Like a bad sports radio call come to life.
Pittsburg will do whatever they can to be a win now team as long as Crosby and malkin are there. The rebuild will be long but in the worst case scenario, they won cups already. I picked MTL because its impossible for them to lose considering what they gave up
Too early to tell but agree with Big Boi above, it’s hard to see MTL coming out of this poorly. No risk, some reward.
I vote for option D: Nobody won. :)
Pens are a tire fire, habs probably won the trade. Sharks did well to offload most of Karlsson’s ticket.
Caps, flyers or rangers fan? Haha
None of the above. But thanks for trolling.
The trade outcome won’t be finished until Hughes finalizes another deal involving Petry. And that will happen quite soon cause there’s no way he suits up for Montreal. Montreal may have to retain some salary but Petry is good for at least a second round pick at $3 million annually.
That’s only one round lower than what karlsson got and petry also has a partial no trade. I’m not so confident they will make out that well.